Gary Pekas
By Estanislao Albano, Jr.
(This is the raw record of my litte debate with Rep. Roilo Golez alternately on the Facebook Wall of Rep. Janette Loreto Garin and the Message box of Rep. Golez. The encounter was set up after Rep. Golez commented on my post asking how come the anti-RH Bill champion has only two children on the Wall of Rep. Garin. Read on and then tell me later who won the debate.
Estanislao Albano: Like Inquirer columnist Raul Pangalangan (So what’s the Catholic advice to Salve?, May 27,2011 issue) I have a nagging doubt that these anti-RH Bill congressmen have never touched contraceptives. May be we could challenge Rep. Roilo Golez to answer this question while strapped to a polygraph machine: Being an advocate of the "children are assets" school of thought, how come you only have two children and how come you only have four grandchildren? How were you able to keep the number of your children to two?
Roilo Golez: My wife had a problem with her ovary and had difficulty with having a second pregnancy. It took more than five years for the second child to come and required lots of care from the doctor and lots of prayers before the patron saint of my wife's home town in Loboc, Bohol, Our Lady of Guadalupe. That's why our second child, our daughter, was named Guadalupe after the virgin. My wife had to regretfully undergo a hysterectomy after our second child, so she could not bear any more children after that. We have five grandchildren, not four. BTW, if we follow the principle that only those who can afford can have children, does that mean the poorest of the poor, who cannot even fully take care of themselves by the standards of the well off, are not entitled to have children? How do we measure capacity to take care of children? Material? Ability to love? Material but inadequate love and care? Love and care but inadequate material things? By the way, of the 30 million increase in our population since 1992, from 65M to 95M, 4 million accounted for by those below the poverty line and 26 by the better off. So why blame the poor for the increase in population?
Roilo Golez: Kindly listen to this statement from a very respected Manila Rotarian doctor: Roilo Golez, Rotary Manila Debate on RH with Cong. Joey Zubiri, 26 May 2011 (7) www.youtube.com
This is the Debate on RH sponsored by the Rotary Club of Manila between Cong. Roilo Golez (Anti-RH) and Cong. joey Zubiri (Pro RH). Cong. Edcel Lagman, as ea...
Estanislao Albano: Thank you, sir, for going out of your way to react to my Wall post. With your explanation, we can now leave the number of your children out of the discussion. Before I answer your questions and without meaning any disrespect, I cannot resist the light comment that there is some sort of “irony” in your being anti-RH Bill because what we believe to be one of the main answers to the poverty in the country is encapsulized in your surname. Sadly, you are in the Goye side. My answer to your question is the principle of responsible parenthood. It’s not a question of the poor being and not being entitled to have children but if in bringing children into the world, they have acted as responsible parents. To my mind, to thousands of couples all over the land, responsible parenthood would mean not having a child at all because a responbsible parent or person to start with would not want an innocent and vulnerable being to share in his deplorable conditions. May be that is too harsh in your lights but I am willing to compromise and say that at least poor parents, say in squatter areas, should limit themselves to the number of children which would give the latter better chance to transfer to better living area during their lifetime.
Estanislao Albano: Sir, as for your question during the Harapan why we should be pushing the RH Bill when it will only benefit the contraceptive manufacturers, here are my counter questions: If the AFP will buy arms and other war equipment, the arms dealers will make a killing not to mention the generals with their kickbacks. Because of this, are we to forego the long delayed modernization of the AFP? No contractor in his right mind would take on a project without assurance of profits. Does that mean you you no longer use your CDF for infrastructure development?
Estanislao Albano: Sir, this is my reaction to you argument during the Harapan that it is not true a smaller population would mean better economic status for the people because there are countries with lower population densities than the Philippines but are poorer than we are and there are countries like Singapore with much much higher population density than we do which are very rich. Your reasoning assumes that the economic usefulness of land in Singapore, the Philippines and that African country you mentioned are equal. My family owns a .7 hectare ricefield. Would you anti-RH Bill folks please go to Singapore and look for a land owner there willing to exchange his .7 hectare land or even just say .007 hectare part of it with mine? Comparing population densities is meaningless when we talk of countries in the first world and in the third world. The number of people the same measure of land in the two countries could sustain is the real determinant of whether one has a problem with population or not. The yield of our ricefield is not enough to meet all the needs of my family of four but the same area of land in Singapore could sustain the rich lifestyle of hundreds of people. If the Singaporeans were also farmers like us, Singapore would be a lot poorer than we are now given its minuscule area and its current population.
Estanislao Albano: Regarding your interpretation of concept of the separation of Church and State being basically that the state should not interfere in church matters and not the other way around, are you aware of this following instruction of Apostle Peter, the first pope, to the believers: “Therefore submit yourself to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme. Or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.” I Peter 2:13, 14? Does Apostle Peter sound like he would approve of this attempt of the church, in alliance with its allies in Congress, to derail the RH Bill?
Roilo Golez: Unfortunately, the concept of separation of Church & State is not biblical. During those times, religious beliefs were imposed and non- adherence could be fatal. This concept is a Jeffersonian legacy embodied in the US Constitution as an act of defiance to the King of England:
There is often debate about what exactly the First Amendment means, however, in an 1802 letter to the Danbury Baptists, Thomas Jefferson made clear that the purpose of the First Amendment was to establish a "wall of separation" between Church and State in order to protect individuals' right of conscience:
Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.
Roilo Golez: On Singapore, you mention the Singapore of today, but forget the Singapore prior to Lee Kuan Yew, when it boasted only of a teeming port that was the crossroad of the Indian Ocean and the China Sea-Pacific Ocean, primarily a transshipment port, still part of Malaya. Then it became a hub of shipyards then financial center. Manila was way ahead of Singapore in the 50s, even 60s, but it's much higher population density, overcrowdedness did not become an obstacle to progress because of Lee Kuan Yew's leadership. With comparable leadership, we can develop several Singapores within the Philippines and some have the makings already in Metro Manila and other high density development centers.
Estanislao Albano: Actually, whatever the origin of the concept of the separation of church and state, as Roman Catholics, should'nt the CBCP be obeying and not setting aside the teaching of Apostle Paul who they claim was the first pope? And was there a time in US history when the Danbury Baptists tried to derail a US Congress legislation?
Estanislao Albano: Sir, you mentioned the phrase "wall of separation" in your explanation above. It does not seem to apply in the country when it comes to the RC. What we have here is a wall which the government cannot cross and I suppose has never intended to cross but which should give way every time the RC clergy feels that the government does not adhere or bow to the church such as in the case of the RH Bill.
Estanislao Albano: Sir, I understand how Lee Kuan Yew was able to lead Singapore into the rich nation it now is. I am not disputing that. What I was only pointing out in my comment was that you were wrong about saying that there is no connection between the poverty and population of the country by comparing the population densities of that African country, the Philippines and Singapore. As far as I am concerned, when the services, economic opportunities and natural resources are no longer enough to go around. Overpopulation need not sweep the nation all at ones. I am sure you agree with me that it is already being experienced in many urban centers in the country but of course, will never be felt in the enclaves of the rich. Hundreds of thousands of families are already affected just like that of Salve who was featured in the PDI four days ago.
Roilo Golez: You cannot compare defense and public works expenditures with contraceptives because the former are basic requirements which a sovereign nation cannot do without. My pdaf projects are all for basic projects.
Estanislao Albano: Okey, you might be correct there, sir. What's your comment on my response to your question about whether or not the poor who cannot even take care of themselves are entitled to have children?
Estanislao Albano: Please respond also to the following questions raised in my other post in Rep. Garin's Wall: Is having millions of children being born in shanties, being malnourished, being unable to go to school due to lack of finances a prelude to economic progress? Will more or less big families in the squatters areas in your district make it easier for your city to achieve super city status?
Estanislao Albano: Sir, have you also considered the environmental toll of a runaway population growth? The dead rivers, the overfished seas, the denuded mountains, the vanished wildlife, the springs and bodies of water that have dried up for good? This article gives you a sampling of the impact of a large population to the environment. If you have any doubts as to the veracity of the article, I could bring you to the place so you can verify yourself. http://northnotes.posterous.com/catholic-village-accepts-population-control-0
Estanislao Albano: Sir, if you have nothing more to say, I will now post our exchange in my blog.
Estanislao Albano: I did not yet post the conversation in my blog as you might want to say something more, sir. It would be helpful if you could react to my question on the environmental toll of the large local population starting from the dead Pasig River, the other bodies of water in MM that are now sewers, the overfished seas, the wildlife species going extinct, denudation, the disappearance of water resources, etc. This is because so far, the environment has not been mentioned in your debates in Congress and even in the media. The environmental degradation in the country will escalate as the population continues to bloat.
Roilo Golez: Sorry, I have more to say, but not now. On the Pasig River, it had long been dead even in the 70s or earlier when the population was around 50M, because of the industries along the river and Laguna Lake. It is our defective environment policy and implementation that is to blame. For one, the Laguba Lake Development Authority generates revenue by charging industries for releasing effluents into the river. We should teach our people how to manage their waste, as even the low density areas have problems with their lakes, rivers and creeks which have been converted into sewers. Look at the Marilao River, an area where populaton density is not that high. Again I go back to high density areas like Tokyo, HK, Washington DC, Columbia River, Ohio River, Mississippi River, etc, where rivers have been well maintained in spite of the huge population. More to follow but not now.
· Estanislao Albano Thank you, sir, for taking the time to explain your position on the RH Bill. Hope you will find the time to entertain questions from me in the future as I have a lot more to ask.
